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The 'hood' command.

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The 'hood' command.

Postby RiderOnTheStorm » Thu Jun 26, 2014 6:44 pm

Can this command be named something else? Simply raising your hood does not make it impossible to tell any details besides height. The command and what it does pretty obviously implies that you are actively trying to hide every detail about yourself, you keep your arm/hands hidden, keep your head down so nobody gets a good look at your face or long hair.

The fact that it changes your sdesc and hides your desc completely makes this pretty obvious.

OOCly or ICly treating it like all you did was raise your hood is pretty shoddy RP.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Hawkwind » Thu Jun 26, 2014 6:50 pm

People who wears hoods indoors are idiots.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby tehkory » Thu Jun 26, 2014 6:59 pm

Hawkwind wrote:People who where hoods indoors are idiots.

Helpful.
RiderOnTheStorm wrote:Can this command be named something else? Simply raising your hood does not make it impossible to tell any details besides height. The command and what it does pretty obviously implies that you are actively trying to hide every detail about yourself, you keep your arm/hands hidden, keep your head down so nobody gets a good look at your face or long hair.

The fact that it changes your sdesc and hides your desc completely makes this pretty obvious.

OOCly or ICly treating it like all you did was raise your hood is pretty shoddy RP.


It is a thick, pale leather cloak.

It will partially cover the upper-legs, upper-arms, head,
neck, lower-legs and lower-arms.

Except it's probably more realistic that we can't tell people apart at a distance, given the armor they're wearing and the fact that cloaks cover heads already anyway. Coifs, too. Probably more realistic if we're playing that we can't tell much about a person, unless we're in the room with them. PCs are well-armored, now. They're covered in cloth and leather, and their faces are shadowed.

Better if we have to get into the room(and roleplay with eachother) to study/look at eachother! Uncertainity is awesome.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Throttle » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:02 pm

I think the fact that the hood completely masks the wearer means people are within rights to roleplay suspicion and apprehension. You can't raise your hood and then demand that others refrain from acting wary just because you don't think you have anything to hide. If you just want to keep your hair dry, set a dmote or something.

Human beings are naturally suspicious of people who hide their faces, and it's particularly problematic that you currently can't actually tell if it's even a human or an orc because the itemization is so simple and everyone just shows up as the same leather-cloaked individual.

Maybe it'd be worth a code change sometime in the future so that hoods only hide your description when scanned from another room, not to people in the actual room. Then some cloaks with particularly deep hoods can have two settings, one for simply raising the hood and one for deliberately trying to conceal one's identity, so people can be unambiguously shady.
Last edited by Throttle on Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:11 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby RiderOnTheStorm » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:05 pm

Tehkory. What.

No.

Your cloak does not cover your head rp'ly unless you raise the hood. Are you trolling, or what. And I'm pretty sure the design of a coif is not that obstructing, it's like an old school leather football helmet. Not a plate mail helmet.

Also, yes @ Throttle.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby radioactivejesus » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:07 pm

help study might be relevant to this discussion
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Throttle » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:10 pm

Study takes time and you can fail the check, plus it looks weird and requires that you do something a bit excessive in order to get information that, in almost all cases, should realistically be available at a glance. It's not really much of a solution.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby RiderOnTheStorm » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:14 pm

Help study is relevant because it makes it even more obvious you are doing way more than raising your hood.

Do none of you own hoodies? I dunno about you, but using my hood doesn't make my face hard to see or turn my hands invisible.

It also gets you shady looks from some people when wearing the hood isn't really warranted.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Onasaki » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:44 pm

In my experiences, the hood command isn't working for some cloaks, even though the cloaks specifically state there's a hood with them.

I've opened a ticket for it recently.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby WorkerDrone » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:54 pm

Onasaki, the hood command should work for just about all of them, though the orc tattered cloaks -might- possibly be bugged, in which case you're better off just getting a new one made.

To make use of the "hood" command, make sure the cloak is worn 'about', but on the "overwear" or "on chest" position.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby tehkory » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:16 pm

RiderOnTheStorm wrote:Man.

So, I expect that you rp not being able to see rabbits/squirrels on scan, right? If you can't tell a dude from an orc one room away, you might as well just not use the scan command because you are blind as a bat.

ETA : You should probably never play a sneaky type, since you would of course walk into rabbits/etc and then get eaten by a nearby warg when you fail the check.



RiderOnTheStorm wrote:Tehkory. What.

No.

Your cloak does not cover your head rp'ly unless you raise the hood. Are you trolling, or what. And I'm pretty sure the design of a coif is not that obstructing, it's like an old school leather football helmet. Not a plate mail helmet.

Also, yes @ Throttle.


Throttle back the aggressiveness. What I'm saying is exactly in line with what throttle's saying: you should be nervous in the wilderness, and while at three rooms away you can see a rabbit's game, at three rooms away you can't tell one humanoid from another so easily. Hoods up? Again: this hood -covers- your head, codedly. It makes it hard to see your features. This coif -covers- your head. It makes it impossible to see hair. At three rooms away, at one room away, you should have doubt. That could be an orc. That could be a human.

I'm not sure how it's confusing that, at the maximum range of a longbow, you just might not know who exactly you're shooting at.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby WorkerDrone » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:17 pm

I see what you did there, Kory.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Throttle » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:45 pm

Had me reading that sentence five times wondering what the hell he was saying to me.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby sosaria » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:19 pm

I know we're all passionate about the game, but tone down the passive/active aggressiveness when posting please!

Personal opinion... if somebody shot somebody that was hooded (due to the hood command) because they were out in hostile territory "by accident due to mistaking him as an orc", I'm inclined to say that's a plausible explaination.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby caellyndria » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:30 pm

I think part of the awkward that comes of this is the clash of OOC game command and RP environment. I like Throttle's suggestion about people looking a certain way from afar, then as actual people up closer.

Think about this, though, game mechanics aside-- when there's an IC rule about not putting hoods on citywide or outside... that's weird. Don't even think about the hood command. Think about not being able to pull your hood up in rain because a Guard came in and said no. And that you might get shot.

I know the intent. I know the reason. But it's also jarring for RP. Is there a balance or a fix? Probably not one that everyone will be happy with. But it's a metagame creep coming IG that's a little hard to explain in an IC sense, especially in a game with seasons and weather.

If a command exists, people will use it. A week from now, that post IG or on the forums will creep down the list and become a little obsolete. Some newb or PC from another sphere, or someone who just plain doesn't read forums or forgot will put up their hood, then we'll have the silliness of someone getting capped for it because it's some backwoods law now. All because of some metagame command.

You see the skew there?

I personally would just get close enough to use the study command and RP through. Someone wearing a hood outside isn't that odd, in theory, despite what the command does. That aside, I'm all about the RP of uncertainty and the risk, not the shoot and charge. We're an RPI, right?

Edit: I'd also suggest that instead of unleashing on people with code in suspect situations with hood, to yell for them to lower it from a room away or so while training arrows if you think you have reason. Ask them to lower their hood. If they run like hell, welp. Then you chase and cap them.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby EltanimRas » Fri Jun 27, 2014 1:08 am

Throttle wrote:Maybe it'd be worth a code change sometime in the future so that hoods only hide your description when scanned from another room, not to people in the actual room. Then some cloaks with particularly deep hoods can have two settings, one for simply raising the hood and one for deliberately trying to conceal one's identity, so people can be unambiguously shady.

Yes, please. I'd suggest that the simple use of a hood still hide your sdesc/ldesc in the same room, but not your mdesc. I.e., identifying someone lightly hooded might not take a 'study', but it should take a 'look'.

Emoting and dmoting one's hood up and down is a fair stopgap option inside town walls (although not necessarily an intuitive one for new players), but it doesn't make much sense outside the walls, where confusion at a distance should be an issue.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby krelm » Fri Jun 27, 2014 2:49 am

I could just remove the ability for the cloaks to mask sdescs with the hood command. Thoughts?

Edit: Thus, it removes awkward code clunkiness, and, if you want to say your hood is up, you can just RP it.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby twitchyweasel » Fri Jun 27, 2014 7:58 am

Whatever the group consensus ends up being on this issue isn't super important to me. I haven't used the hood command, yet, but my PC has certainly worn his hood IG.

However, it is extremely immersion breaking for this to be an IC issue... People saying that it is against the rules to wear your hood in the wilderness seems strange to me. It is a code issue. Not an IC issue.
Last edited by twitchyweasel on Fri Jun 27, 2014 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Icarus » Fri Jun 27, 2014 8:03 am

You are silly people! Fighting over hoods. Did I ever mention I made a thread to tone things down?

No one has posted any rules. They have simply said that folks running about hooded in the wilds are at risk of being mistaken for orcs. This is IC, and frankly makes sense with how small some of you are codedly.

So, relax. And don't get shot.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby LuckyV » Fri Jun 27, 2014 8:44 am

You made it in Utterby forum, Icarus.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby EltanimRas » Fri Jun 27, 2014 8:48 am

Icarus wrote:No one has posted any rules. They have simply said that folks running about hooded in the wilds are at risk of being mistaken for orcs.

:?:

If we want this to be true (which I agree it should be), then, given the current state of the code, we should OOCly advise people against raising their hoods by dmote only when in the wilderness (because doing so averts the ICly logical consequences of the action being RPed).

This advice would directly oppose the suggestion made in the OP:

RiderOnTheStorm wrote:OOCly or ICly treating it like all you did was raise your hood is pretty shoddy RP.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Rivean » Fri Jun 27, 2014 9:26 am

As a tangent:

Regardless of my opinion on this particular topic (and I may or may not even have one), "X is shoddy RP" is plainly forum code for "Let's fight!"
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Icarus » Fri Jun 27, 2014 9:50 am

Folks can do whatever they want. But just realize that, at a distance, if you see a hooded figure moving through thick woods, like Mirkwood, it ain't exactly easy to see their flowing golden locks and say, "Yes, thar be a human."

Even staff have that issue sometimes.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby Tepes » Fri Jun 27, 2014 9:51 am

I own a cloak IRL. It can hide 90% of my features of I want it to. The other 10% is my height and size.
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Re: The 'hood' command.

Postby MrDvAnt » Fri Jun 27, 2014 10:28 am

No offense, but seriously...you guys bitch a lot. Do you all complain this much irl?

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