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General Questions for Laketown

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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Icarus » Thu Dec 05, 2013 11:50 am

Well, for Alpha we will be in Utterby, a smaller lumber outpost downriver. We want to test away from Laketown itself invade we have to murder you all in a Wargicaine.

All the documentation has been mostly fleshed, so ask away on what types of things you want to know in specific.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Nimrod » Thu Dec 05, 2013 12:15 pm

bjg2k1us wrote:I think if it's used sparingly as the staff suggests it will, and if 'downsouthwest' can be abbreviated as 'dsw' for movement, etc., I could grow to appreciate it. It does open up some interesting possibilities, for sure.


upnortheast may be abbreviated as upne or une. :)
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Emilio » Thu Dec 05, 2013 1:12 pm

I found some interesting information in Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esgaroth

So we'll be in a city-state governed by some kind of a republican government instead of a King where the population elects their leader. I also read that the men are distant cousins of the Rohirrim and persons and places names will be norse-like.

Am I right?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Nimrod » Thu Dec 05, 2013 5:27 pm

You are correct, sir!
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Freon » Fri Dec 06, 2013 12:14 am

I'm curious about the relation between the men of Laketown and Thranduil's elves. They definitely interacted enough and that much is evident in the wiki under "Master of Laketown":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esgaroth

He was one of the few people in the town who did not eagerly welcome Bilbo and the Dwarves, fearing reprisal from the Wood Elf King.


It would imply that news of the Wood Elves' 'visitors' had reached them during Bilbo's captivity.

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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Drew7uk » Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:26 am

Will roles and races be applied for purely through RPP, as they used to be, or will you guys potentially look at opening out role applications, as done on games like Armageddon?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Frigga » Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:21 am

So we'll be in a city-state governed by some kind of a republican government instead of a King where the population elects their leader. I also read that the men are distant cousins of the Rohirrim and persons and places names will be norse-like.


Laketown is unique of all other major settlements of Free Peoples during the Third Age. They have neither King nor Steward, nor a nobility based on Numenorean bloodline. So, we'll be seeing a much different society than we had in the past incarnation of Gondor, or even what was planned for SOI3's Angrenost.

The people of Laketown elect their leaders, so we'll be seeing different characteristics both in NPC leadership, and what those leaders expect to see in others. People won't have "well, I'm a noble" coattails to rely on. Those that excel to the leadership of Laketown draw on different merits - political finesse, military honor,

Since this is a remote location, I, kind of, expect to see a lot of differences in the local society, politics, economy, laws, food and available items like weapons, armor, clothing and equipment from previous SoI versions.


This location is remote, but Laketown is the trading hub of Rhovanion because of its position on Long Lake, and its interaction with the Mirkwood Elves. So, there will be differences, but don't get the impression that Laketown is outside of civilization.

As for food, obviously one of the key differences will be a focus on fish as a staple food product and a subsequent expansion of Fishing as a major crafting interest. Also, an expansion of butchering and butchering products from hunting/farm-raised animals.

Given the ability for code to now support it, and the distance of Laketown from the production locals, we'll also be focusing more on spices as an optional (and likely expensive) optional addition to recipes, rather than making them central and neccessary to basic dishes as in the past. Instead, herbs will take more precedence as a flavoring component.

For clothing, for most people, we'll see a focus on the practical well-wearing clothing of fisherfolk. (I just want to clarify that versus the past where working class = clothing that defaults to have descriptions about being dirty, the differences will be in material and construction.) Given the cooler climate, we'll have a higher emphasis on furs as practical wear as well as for a show of wealth. For high-income traders, artisans, and the political gurus like the Master, we'll obviously still see some of that flounce and fashion.

As an aside, if anyone has any particular interest in regards to any of those areas, feel free to drop me a PM or an email at Frigga@middle-earth.us, I always love chatting with people about economic/crafting type stuff, and would welcome ideas/input.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Emilio » Sat Dec 07, 2013 1:54 pm

Well, for norse-like arms and armour, I found this page.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viking_Age_arms_and_armour
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Drew7uk » Mon Dec 09, 2013 7:51 am

Frigga wrote:The people of Laketown elect their leaders, so we'll be seeing different characteristics both in NPC leadership, and what those leaders expect to see in others. People won't have "well, I'm a noble" coattails to rely on. Those that excel to the leadership of Laketown draw on different merits - political finesse, military honor...


I love the sound of this fluctuation and have faith it'll keep the RP really interesting.

With that said, have you guys considered which ways these expectations might be inflicted via player roles, or will it be done purely through NPC leadership and storytelling?

My meaning is that it might be a cool mechanic to have some of these expectations dripped out via player roles or organizations directly connected with said leader. For a few examples:

Town Guard - organization head is pro Laketown leader, therefore Guard PCs benefit from elements of corruption, increased wages, less duties, and therefore a rise in crime rates

Town Noble - anti Laketown leader, taxed heavily, his followers are affected and have to turn to other means of income

Fellowship of Masons - Master is pro Laketown leader and has the leader's ear on matters of smuggling in the town, to whom he relays information. Masons benefit from superior material for their work

Frigga wrote:This location is remote, but Laketown is the trading hub of Rhovanion because of its position on Long Lake, and its interaction with the Mirkwood Elves. So, there will be differences, but don't get the impression that Laketown is outside of civilization.


I was going to ask this elsewhere, but this leads in pretty well!

Given the reliance of Laketown on the Wood-Elves (and vice versa), how do you guys intend to highlight the importance of that relationship in-game through plots, roles, and economy? Will it have a visible impact on these things?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Icarus » Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:41 am

I want to find a balance between PC involvement with plots and such and NPC top down plot development.

A challenge in the past has been that PCs "hoard" plots when they tend to get heavily involved in them. So, anything to limit hoarding I'm all for.

As far as Elves, there is certainly important trade between the two settlements. Additionally, I would believe that goods from Framsburg are sent via barge by the same water-route that goes past the Elvenholde, and that the Elves put tarrifs on these goods. I could certainly see some tension there with unpaid tarrifs.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Emilio » Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:59 am

Town nobles??? Don't you mean rich merchants? From what I read, there are no nobility social class at Laketown.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Drew7uk » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:15 am

Drew7uk wrote:Will roles and races be applied for purely through RPP, as they used to be, or will you guys potentially look at opening out role applications, as done on games like Armageddon?


Any take on this one from the staff?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Frigga » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:34 am

Town nobles??? Don't you mean rich merchants? From what I read, there are no nobility social class at Laketown.


Yes, the higher-ups would be merchants and bureaucrats, really - there's no "nobility" in the same sense as Gondor has it.

Any take on this one from the staff?


Can you clarify what you mean by "opening out?" Do you mean how we will get roles when we first have Alpha? Or do you mean getting away from an RPP system?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Emilio » Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:09 am

I think he means getting race, special and generic roles packages using RPP when applying for a character.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Nimrod » Wed Dec 18, 2013 4:10 pm

Emilio wrote:How long do we have to wait to gain detail information around Laketown? Since this is a remote location, I, kind of, expect to see a lot of differences in the local society, politics, economy, laws, food and available items like weapons, armor, clothing and equipment from previous SoI versions.

You are correct, sir! We're very happy to say that though the general feel of the game will be familiar to all who've played SoI in the past, the overall story arc will be at player level, for the most part, and much more intense compared to the vast story lines of yesterday.

Politics will play a MUCH larger role in Laketown than it did in Minas Tirith. Why? Because anyone can take part if they wish, the lowest of players may rise to become part of city politics. Politicians will also play a keen role in the protection of the city, along with the city guard / militia.

Laws? Those are for politicians to decide. Of course we'll have a basic set of laws in place to begin, but they can be modified, added to or removed by those with proper authority.

The economy is still being talked about.

Food? Think fishing village supplemented by hunters who range out into Mirkwood.

Weapons, armor and clothing? I'm not going to comment on those at this time.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Drew7uk » Wed Dec 18, 2013 5:49 pm

Frigga wrote:Can you clarify what you mean by "opening out?" Do you mean how we will get roles when we first have Alpha? Or do you mean getting away from an RPP system?


In short: will roles/races be available through application in Alpha or the main game, with or without RPP still a factor.

Edit: adding some more. To explain further, presumably we're starting a fresh game on launch with no RPP, which means that certain races - Dwarves, Elves, whatever - won't be immediately available until people earn those points, OR they are granted through 'special application'. Is this something you'd likely look at 1. for the opening, and to combat the lacking RPP issue and 2. in the long-term as a solution to role/race distribution?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Emilio » Wed Dec 18, 2013 6:05 pm

When I mentioned food, I meant different ways of preparing and cooking. People most often eat soups and stews in cold climate while in warmer areas may cook their meals differently.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Tepes » Fri Dec 20, 2013 1:54 pm

Playable badguys in alpha?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Emilio » Fri Dec 20, 2013 2:01 pm

I would gladly chop off the heads of bad guys for food.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Nimrod » Fri Dec 20, 2013 3:44 pm

Tepes wrote:Playable badguys in alpha?

Affirmative.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Tepes » Fri Dec 20, 2013 4:31 pm

Sweet. I am interested in one of the ideas I saw before. 8-)
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Nimrod » Sat Dec 21, 2013 8:59 pm

Drew7uk wrote:In short: will roles/races be available through application in Alpha or the main game, with or without RPP still a factor.
Roles will not be available at the onset of Alpha. We have no specific plans to offer roles during Alpha either, but it's possible we may decide to flesh out a few roles that may or may not tie in to the transition to Beta/Open, which will be in Laketown. Of course we'll always entertain proposals from established players so long as they're not so far-fetched as to stretch reality.

Drew7uk wrote:Edit: adding some more. To explain further, presumably we're starting a fresh game on launch with no RPP, which means that certain races - Dwarves, Elves, whatever - won't be immediately available until people earn those points, OR they are granted through 'special application'. Is this something you'd likely look at 1. for the opening, and to combat the lacking RPP issue and 2. in the long-term as a solution to role/race distribution?
You are correct sir, all players will start Alpha with zero RPP. In order to keep things fair for everyone we will not be accepting 'special applications' at the beginning of Alpha.
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Drew7uk » Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:50 am

Nimrod wrote:
Drew7uk wrote:In short: will roles/races be available through application in Alpha or the main game, with or without RPP still a factor.
Roles will not be available at the onset of Alpha. We have no specific plans to offer roles during Alpha either, but it's possible we may decide to flesh out a few roles that may or may not tie in to the transition to Beta/Open, which will be in Laketown. Of course we'll always entertain proposals from established players so long as they're not so far-fetched as to stretch reality.

Drew7uk wrote:Edit: adding some more. To explain further, presumably we're starting a fresh game on launch with no RPP, which means that certain races - Dwarves, Elves, whatever - won't be immediately available until people earn those points, OR they are granted through 'special application'. Is this something you'd likely look at 1. for the opening, and to combat the lacking RPP issue and 2. in the long-term as a solution to role/race distribution?
You are correct sir, all players will start Alpha with zero RPP. In order to keep things fair for everyone we will not be accepting 'special applications' at the beginning of Alpha.


Great, thanks Nimrod! I was mostly addressing full game opening for role/RPP questions, guessing that things would be far simpler for Alpha. In either case, looking forward to what you guys have planned as always!
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Drew7uk » Thu Dec 26, 2013 7:10 am

Inconsequential question, but is Utterby likely to remain open when the game goes to full release for other storylines/adventures?
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Re: General Questions for Laketown

Postby Emilio » Thu Dec 26, 2013 7:59 pm

How many stats are we going to have and what are they?
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