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How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

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How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby jdidds » Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:45 am

.. And by that I mean physical characteristics. Do you see them as they were in the LotR films, more like the orcs in Warhammer or something else entirely?
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby EltanimRas » Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:12 am

The orcs in the LotR movies always looked like zombies to me. Then again, I'm kind of near-sighted. :P
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby jdidds » Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:33 am

Yeah, wasn't too big of a fan of the LotR's orcs myself. Too gross and ugly. Much prefer the Warhammer style orc characteristics.

If I remember cannon correctly, didn't Tolkien describe them as just big ugly men?
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Manarath » Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:17 am

I'm quite a fan of the LotR movies looks myself due to the fact orcs have a theme that sets them far apart from the warhammer brutes, or even DnD orcs as both are just races unto themselves. While the orcs in our setting were created through corruption and are considered for the most part outright evil. The movies showed that aspect quite well if you ask me, while at the same time showing they were not unintelligent like the orcs in the warhammer setting in the few times they got some talking screen time.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby krelm » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:45 pm

Warhammer orks are basically the comic relief of the Warhammer universe-- they're big and bad, sure, but they're also hilarious, and this is often reflected by their over-the-top Cockney accents, and more often than not portrayed by the rules as well (IE, how most of them explode on a roll of 1, like Weirdboyz and Flashgitz).

As such, I always imagine orcs to be more like the orcs in the movies-- like Manarath said, I feel like they did a pretty good job of portraying the savagery and brutal cunning that most orcs within LOTR possess.

Whenever I'm making an orc and I get to the description, I try to make it look as much like an orc in the movies would like. I never have, and never will play a green orc.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby jdidds » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:57 pm

Good points from both Manarath and Krelm. I agree with that they did a good job of capturing essence of the orks in Tolkien's works.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Throttle » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:57 pm

Yeah, aside from a few that look like they're falling apart, I think the films portray orcs quite well.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby radioactivejesus » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:00 am

Throttle wrote:Yeah, aside from a few that look like they're falling apart, I think the films portray orcs quite well.

I too picture my orcs in lotr much like I did in the movies, they're just so delightfully foul.

is this the guy you're thinking about? He doesn't look zombie-like to me, just a bit hacked up. They had likely seen some extremely heavy fighting up to that point in the movie, I'm sure plenty were sporting festering wounds.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Snapdragon » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:14 am

radioactivejesus wrote:
Throttle wrote:Yeah, aside from a few that look like they're falling apart, I think the films portray orcs quite well.

I too picture my orcs in lotr much like I did in the movies, they're just so delightfully foul.

is this the guy you're thinking about? He doesn't look zombie-like to me, just a bit hacked up. They had likely seen some extremely heavy fighting up to that point in the movie, I'm sure plenty were sporting festering wounds.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Hazgarn » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:30 am

This guy was always my favorite:

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He looks like Sloth from The Goonies had babies with a pig, and this unfortunate lovechild was afflicted with elephantiasis.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby krelm » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:38 am

Hazgarn wrote:This guy was always my favorite:

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He looks like Sloth from The Goonies had babies with a pig, and this unfortunate lovechild was afflicted with elephantiasis.


I knew a guy in old SoI who used that orc as inspiration for a character of his.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby BashSkull52 » Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:25 pm

Who wouldn't? Gothmog had a great look in the films!
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Justanothacivy » Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:05 pm

BashSkull52 wrote:Who wouldn't? Gothmog had a great look in the films!


Agreed. I really enjoyed the variety in which the twisted forms of the orcs were interpreted in the films. They didn't look similar at all showing that they came from different regions when they were brought together to fight the oppression of the evil humans.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Croaker » Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:46 pm

Keeping in mind...
- Orcs and goblins are identical. There's absolutely zero difference between an orc and a goblin, according to Tolkien, except that one term was used first, probably due to influence from George Macdonald, and another came later.

- Orcs were created when Melkor captured and corrupted elves.

- Orcs/Orks are ALWAYS shorter than humans, and the tallest can only reach near-human height.

- Uruk-hai can be "man-high."

"But there were some others that were horrible: man-high, but with goblin-faces, sallow, leering, squint-eyed. Do you know, they reminded me at once of that Southerner at Bree; only he was not so obviously orc-like as most of these were.’

‘We had many of these half-orcs to deal with at Helm’s Deep. It seems plain now that that Southerner was a spy of Saruman’s; but whether he was working with the Black Riders, or for Saruman alone, I do not know."

"They were disturbed to see half a dozen large ill-favoured Men lounging against the inn-wall; they were squint-eyed and sallow-faced. ‘Like that friend of Bill Ferny’s at Bree,’ said Sam. ‘Like many that I saw at Isengard,’ muttered Merry."

- A half-orc (Uruk-hai) spy is present in Bree during the Fellowship of the Ring.

"In one of the windows he caught a glimpse of a sallow face with sly, slanting eyes; but it vanished at once. ‘So that’s where that southerner is hiding!’ he thought. ‘He looks more than half like a goblin.’"

- Uruk-hai are what particular half-orcs call themselves.

- Uruk-hai are created by breeding men and orcs together.*

"Men could under the domination of Morgoth or his agents in a few generations be reduced almost to orc level and then they would or could be made to mate with orcs producing new breeds more large and cunning. There is no doubt that long afterwards, in the third age, Sarumn rediscovered this or learned of it in lore, and in his lust for mastery committed this, his wickedest deed: the interbreeding of men and orcs."

*While it's possible to breed orcs and elves together, in theory, any raped elf immediately dies according to Tolkien, and no elf would ever consent to breeding with orcs of their own accord.

- There is no "Orkish language."

"It is said that they had no language of their own, but took what they could of other tongues and perverted it to their own liking, yet they made only brutal jargons, scarcely sufficient even for their own needs, unless it were for curses and abuse."

- Orcs are corruptions of the elvish or human form, not new creations.

"They are (or were) squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes; in fact, degraded and repulsive version of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol types."

- In the Silmarillion, elves mistook the appearance of orcs as the Avari.

- Orcs "might have become irredeemable, (at last by Elves and Men,) but that they remain within the Law."


I picture orcs as crude exaggerations of the Mongoloid Stereotype, with darker skin tones. Given a generation or two of inbreeding, which would smooth out such features and skin tone, a half-orc could even pass (albeit with suspicions) among humans as a "Southerner."

Therefore, orcs can't look as snarfagling stupid as they do in the films.

Edit: Sometimes I'm tempted to make an orc from The Last Ringbearer universe, instead of Tolkien canon.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Zargen » Tue Jul 15, 2014 1:28 am

This is my orc.

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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Snapdragon » Tue Jul 15, 2014 2:46 am

That's an impressive arm there. And that belt looks custom. /jealous!
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby BashSkull52 » Tue Jul 15, 2014 4:09 am

Snapdragon wrote:That's an impressive arm there. And that belt looks custom. /jealous!



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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Onasaki » Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:55 am

Croaker wrote:Lots of awesome things!


That information is pretty awesome, sadly, I don't think Vadok Orcs are Uruk-Hai. Though, it does point out some things I've personally felt were more canon then actual game canon.

Like the lack of a true orkish language. Which means, most orcs should be speaking Black-Speech, but time and time again, the admins keep saying no Black Speech...

Personally, I like the orcs in the War of the Ring Game. They're pretty cool.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Hawkwind » Tue Jul 15, 2014 4:56 pm

Basically they are the polar oppisite of Warhammer orks.

Small
Cowardly
Cunning
Weak
Not bright green
Sneaky
Industrious

They are not the brutal, huge tusked brutes that are spoiling for a good fight.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby MrDvAnt » Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:08 pm

We aren't allowed to play Tolkien orcs. If our orc isn't blue, purple,black or some combination and speak in a barely understandable jumble, we get OOC'ly ridiculed.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby WorkerDrone » Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:20 pm

OOCly ridicu--what?

I would love to see various interpretations of the Tolkien orc, from their mode of speech to their overall appearance, as the rules to their creation seems to be lax enough to allow for even a sedate/not monstrous or overly-fantasy interpretation of their appearance.

I understand the hyperbole and exaggeration because I'm pretty prone to using it too when trying to get a point across, but I'll be the first one to file a complaint if I see someone picking fights over the manner in which your orc is played. If it's not hurting immersion, it's enhancing it.

So don't be afraid to try something different, please. I won't guarantee that I, or everyone else will drop the weird phonetic play, or tone down or notch up their descriptions in a manner which appeals to you, but why the hell should that stop you from doing something outside the box?

And if it's in the desire to see change reflected in every player, you'll have to be the change you wish to see.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby MrDvAnt » Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:42 pm

WorkerDrone wrote:OOCly ridicu--what?

I would love to see various interpretations of the Tolkien orc, from their mode of speech to their overall appearance, as the rules to their creation seems to be lax enough to allow for even a sedate/not monstrous or overly-fantasy interpretation of their appearance.

I understand the hyperbole and exaggeration because I'm pretty prone to using it too when trying to get a point across, but I'll be the first one to file a complaint if I see someone picking fights over the manner in which your orc is played. If it's not hurting immersion, it's enhancing it.

So don't be afraid to try something different, please. I won't guarantee that I, or everyone else will drop the weird phonetic play, or tone down or notch up their descriptions in a manner which appeals to you, but why the hell should that stop you from doing something outside the box?

And if it's in the desire to see change reflected in every player, you'll have to be the change you wish to see.



It's been tried. The Old Boys come down like a ton of cockney accented bricks and tell you it's always been done this way and always will. :p
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby WorkerDrone » Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:51 pm

Shit man, I ain't scurred. I'll go all dry British English on this jam. Who needs phonetically typed accents?
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Oblivion » Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:52 pm

Again, going to have to call you out on this. 'Always' is a pretty heavy term to use in a game like this with a player-base as .. well.. long lived as this one's.

There have been plenty of articulate orcs, orc players who don't feel like chopping up every other word with apostrophes, even ones that don't particularly like to be bathed in blood and gore or eat babies.

As was stated before, be the change you want to see. But as has also been said, don't expect everyone else to take up your flag just because you put it up there. It's perfectly acceptable to play your role how you see fit. I mean ffs, I recall an uruk who wore a monocle and another that was called Silver-Tongue because of how he spoke. Think I even recall a half-orc that wore glasses at one point in time heh.

The only thing keeping you from playing how you like, is yourself. If people are going ooc to bash on you, copy it down and report it. Or just don't talk to these people ooc, which is generally the source of such feelings of restriction.

Edited to add*
And always remember, these 'Good Ol' Boys' you mentioned, were all 'Fresh Meat' at one stage or another. They're not better just because they've been around a while and you shouldn't feel like you have to frame yourself by their examples.
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Re: How do you imagine orcs in SoI?

Postby Zargen » Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:48 pm

Pretty much everything oblivion said. Really the only thing we ever agree on is orcs :D

Oh and that was Zogg the half-orc. Previously a slave to house krathas I think. He was half far harad before far harads where around. A pair of bronze-rimmed spectacles. Peak intelligence. Very eloquent fellow. Abhorred blood on his nice pearly white clothes.
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