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Trading

Postby Real » Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:23 pm

I've been giving this some thought, and I believe it could be pretty cool.

Essentially, it gives us a means to keep on doing our thing in terms of gathering without building up a stupid surplus of logs and tanned hides. Yes, there is a clanned craft ingame to pack stamped packages of logs but what do we do with these mystery shipments? How could we do trade in a way that gives both spheres something interesting for the effort?

1. We build a loading dock at the south of Utterby (IC! Oh no!)

2. Once the Lodge Quartermaster gives a certain amount of coin out to the members, indicating prosperity, an object is spawned at the dock; 'a trade emissary brings word of an ship on the way' - The key here is that an orc spy object should also be loaded in the orc warrens 'a spy brings word of a human trade ship'

3. After a few RL days, the spy morphs into 'word of a human trade ship has arrived and some raiders prepare here'. This is for flavor and as a big flag to say 'let's go mess up the whole thing and be orcs about this'

4. At the same time, the emissary morphs into 'a gangplank leading up to a trade ship'. A clanned prog lets you access the ship, which should be a room with no exits. There's nothing to be done with the ship for a few days, it's a liability although RP can ensue on deck and so on. On the ship is an object 'the merchant is prosperous and brings considerable coin', as well as 'a hard-working merchant is here'.

5. An object is spawned on the south bank across the river from Utterby 'a trade ship is visible across the river'. This is used in the 'board trade-ship' craft, which consumes the object and produces 'a series of grappling ropes that are hooked onto a trade ship'. Via clanned prog, the orcs can use the ropes to board the ship, following suit with the 'raid merchant-holdings' craft. (The ropes morph back into the original object after an RL hour or two) -- The orcs can also escape with a clanned 'jump ship' that puts them in the river nearby.

6. The holdings craft doesn't consume the merchant until the very last phase, but each time it's completed the merchant becomes less rich, 'the merchant is hardbitten but wealthy', 'the merchant is worn-down and has little left', 'the merchant is destitute'. -- The phases are set up like this so that Guard/other human PCs can rush in and start combat with the orcs to interrupt the craft.

7. This goes on for a while with back-and-forth, and at the end of the grace period the merchant becomes an NPC who buys the stamped packages. Depending what state the object was in, he'll have larger increments of coin in whatever 'storeroom' he's working from; nothing for destitute, four gold for worn, ten gold for wealthy, twenty gold for prosperous. Who knows, these are examples. If the coin can be introduced into the human sphere, it can be introduced into the orc one, and this will put an interesting shift in power as we start to have more combat-oriented things to spend money on.

8. The humans get to sell their excess and the orcs get to raid. Depending how well either side does, the tables turn. Worst-case, the humans don't get to sell their stamped packages but they don't lose days of crafting, just stocking them up for the next ship.

I'll show you what I mean with the crafts but I dunno what the echoes would be like, bear with me, this is just an idea. We'll need additional crafts for making knotted ropes and grappling hooks. As an aside, I think it would be great to have stamped packages of hides, and stamped packages of -supple- hides that go for significantly more and stimulate the fishing economy. Perhaps just make the first craft require 200 uses of leather squares, and the second 200 uses of supple squares.

Pillaging: board trade-ship
Requires 6 followers
Phase 1: 60 seconds
Phase 2: 60 seconds
Phase 3: 60 seconds
Held or In Room (Consumed): 6 of a knotted length of nettlecloth rope
Held or In Room (Consumed): 6 of a $metaltype grappling hook
Phase 4: 60 seconds
Phase 5: 60 seconds
Phase 6: 10 seconds
In Room (Consumed): a trade ship is visible across the river
Produced: a series of grapples are attached to a trade ship

Once this craft is started, an alarm should go up in Utterby that a force of orcs is attempting to intercept trade. (A zone echo) They have five minutes. PVP ensues.

Pillaging: raid merchant-holdings
Requires 6 followers
Phase 1: 60 seconds
Phase 2: 60 seconds
Phase 3: 60 seconds
Phase 4: 60 seconds
Phase 5: 60 seconds
Phase 6: 10 seconds
In Room (Consumed): a hard-working merchant is here
In Room (Consumed): the merchant is prosperous and brings considerable coin, the merchant is hardbitten but wealthy, the merchant is worn-down and has little left
Produced: a distraught merchant cleans up quite a mess
Produced: the merchant is hardbitten but wealthy, the merchant is worn-down and has little left, the merchant is destitute

The distraught merchant object morphs into the hard-working one after 16 RL hours, allowing for another raid the following day. It should be set up so that if the orcs raid -each- day, they can turn him destitute, but if they miss one Utterby will still be able to make some coin.

Comments?
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Re: Trading

Postby Gobbo » Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:39 pm

Frankly I'd prefer if the orcs COULD steal the shipment, the coin is worthless. The resources are valuable and replaceable.
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Re: Trading

Postby Songweaver » Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:41 pm

This is the sort of thing that I love.

There's a lot to take into consideration, of course, because what's stopping orcs from just hitting the ship in off-peak hours?

I'd add these stipulations:

- Orcs boarding the ship sound an alarm (one of the merchants on board) if they don't do a group craft slaughtering the ship's personal guard -- this would be a combat-oriented groupcraft at a high difficulty (2 group rolls, at least), with total failure meaning taking wounds and fleeing and partial failure meaning one of the guards sounds a horn (before dying) that echoes to the rest of Utterby and the "safe wilderness" north of Utterby. Make the craft last a few minutes with some variable echoes depending on the rolls, so that the orcs can have some RP-fun vs the vNPCs before moving onto the main course.

- Orcs can only board the ship during IG night (to avoid being spotted immediately). I think this would help to discourage off-peak ganking.
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Re: Trading

Postby Tiurabo » Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:44 pm

I'm not sure I see the problem with the whole off-peak thing. What's to stop the ship unloading with no problem because there are only 5-6 orcs online? It takes 7 to do the craft at all.
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Re: Trading

Postby Songweaver » Mon Aug 11, 2014 8:00 pm

Seven players can collaborate to log in at 5am EST, swim the river to avoid dangerous areas, then gank the ship while no human players are logged on. Forcing it to happen at night-time means they're going to have to work a little harder, and will probably encourage them to do it when someone's around human-side to potentially defend.

As stated by Real, the ship doesn't unload immediately. It hangs around for a couple of days.
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Re: Trading

Postby Real » Mon Aug 11, 2014 8:17 pm

Pillaging: assassinate trade-guards
Requires 6 followers
Phase 1: 60 seconds
Phase 2: 60 seconds
Phase 3: 60 seconds
Phase 4: 60 seconds Adroit Hide skill required
Phase 5: 60 seconds Familiar Prowess skill required
Failure Produces: a series of grapples are attached to a trade ship
Phase 6: 10 seconds
In Room (Consumed): a trade ship is visible across the river
Produced: a series of grapples are attached to a trade ship

The badass method that raises no alarms.
As mentioned, it should deal out a couple of minor/moderate cuts on the group if they fail the Adroit check. Also, we'll need a SURVEY SHIP prog from the gangplank to let humans see that, oh no, there are orcs who snuck aboard, I better tell someone instead of having to board the thing to know the difference.

The night thing I'm on-board with, pardon the pun, but I've got nothing in terms of good ways to prevent off-peak raiding. Between NPCs, morph timers, progs to check if enough people are in the zone, I can't think of something that can't be easily exploited or doesn't exclude people with more narrow playtimes.

ETA: I think trade-guards should be branched by using merchant-holdings, to differentiate experienced raid leaders and keep battles conventional during the testing phase, if staff were to go for it.
Last edited by Real on Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:05 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Trading

Postby Justanothacivy » Mon Aug 11, 2014 8:56 pm

Does anyone remember the old bounty giver? Or perhaps the SOI fort battles that had crafts? This rings of the olden days so what did we learn from those last time?

This sort of thing is fun for combat oriented PC's, it can be automated. And honestly if it requires coordination on a larger scale it could literally generate RPT's. I say a single successful raid doesn't entirely ruin the shipment, raiding is literally just grabbing what you can carry and running away with it. So it could be raided and defended multiple times. Give the barge men crafts to strengthen against the raids increasing timers ect.

Resource gathering has been done before, stockpiling logs, wow, exciting yeah? Not as great as drilling on the moon and getting attacked by giant worms, but this boat thing could really put some risk/reward decisions into players hands. Conflict they either act or pass on, both with consequence.

Smaller scale automation shouldn't effect both sides though, or at least not in a large way.


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Re: Trading

Postby Gobbo » Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:03 am

The idea is flawed, the goods transported out of utterby should be the responsibility of the players to escort. Orcs can attack and take the resources by pvp.

Any automated system that encourages avoidance between the two spheres like this is just really silly.
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Re: Trading

Postby ThinkTwice » Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:17 am

I'm not sure how you arrived at the conclusion that this promotes avoidance between the two spheres, but I disagree with you, and am excited that things like this are being proposed on the boards.
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Re: Trading

Postby Fulgrim » Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:43 am

From what I can tell of the proposed system, the crafts/progs merely facilitate players being able to raid these shipments without having their hands held, or making them more effectively defensible. To say it'll merely encourage coordination between players to avoid dealing with PCs is rather damning when it hasn't been implemented or observed in any real capacity yet, or near as far as I can tell, the full extent of it's features has yet to be detailed.

To say "players won't have to interact with eachother" is plainly wrong, as this directly interferes in the economy of the human sphere via players raiding things flowing in or out of it on the orc one. The Merchant Guard will be pressured into doing their job and seeing these adequately defended in person by the Lodge, and the Orcs will face real consequences to attempting anything too twinky (because we see this stuff, mind you) if that's the real concern.

So far all I'm seeing is a system that gives a tangible objective to both sides, and it's being shot down on the basis that tangible objectives that don't need active staff intervention are inherently wrong?
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Re: Trading

Postby Frigga » Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:56 am

To note, there's actually a proposed and built system in place to have planks (and other fun things!) exported. We are just looking into creating some more objects/crafts to get it in place.
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Re: Trading

Postby Nezerin » Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:18 pm

I really like the idea myself. It's almost like adding a capture the flag component to the game. I definitely think it will increase the PvP action and hopefully shift things away from the ambush killing fest that seems to be going on. The only issue I see is trying to make it fair for both parties. 5 minutes to get all the guards together seems low, especially when it has to happen ICly. Granted, if such things tend to happen at night then there is no reason the Guard couldn't have a group there waiting to defend.
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Re: Trading

Postby mongwen » Thu Aug 21, 2014 3:36 pm

The orc spy should be findable as well to make it possible that the shipment's not spotted by the orcs. I'm anti-PVP personally, but I can see the fun in it for those who aren't.
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