Encumbrance and Hindrance

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Brian
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Brian » Sat Feb 21, 2015 11:34 pm

Grommit wrote:
krelm wrote:Woah there, let's pull the brake a moment.
For THIRDERS, armor bonuses, or negatives, do not stack. They used to in old SoI, and it was highly abuseable-- you could hold two shields, wear two shields, and have your deflect skill boosted by like thirty points. Kithrater changed that a long time ago. Now, as far as I'm aware, though you'll probably have to ask Grommit to double-check, only the highest positive or negative granted by armor applies.

What does this mean? If you're holding a shield and wearing two pieces of armor that give +deflect, you'll only get the bonuses from the shield and the piece of armor that gives the HIGHEST bonus.

As far as the discussion goes, I have no useful opinion to add, I just thought I'd shed light onto the situation.
Almost. Actually it ignores the armor's list of skill buffs/debuffs completely. So the + and - deflect boosts on your armor are meaningless, likely made so for the reason Krelm said, but no one got around to removing them from the gear. However the code ignores them in actual combat, it just happens to still show them on eval. Only your shield's deflect boost is counted.

What you're thinking of for applying a single boost might be the electronic enhancers stuff from ARPI, but we don't have electronics in LRPI/SOI.
Haha, all that back and forth only to find this out :p.

Krelm mentioned that you could simply wear a shield for its boost in old SoI and that doesn't seem right. Is that still the case here, or if its worn does it go in the same category as the armor and is ignored, and is only applied if its held?

tehkory
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by tehkory » Sat Feb 21, 2015 11:41 pm

Brian wrote:
Grommit wrote:
krelm wrote:Woah there, let's pull the brake a moment.
For THIRDERS, armor bonuses, or negatives, do not stack. They used to in old SoI, and it was highly abuseable-- you could hold two shields, wear two shields, and have your deflect skill boosted by like thirty points. Kithrater changed that a long time ago. Now, as far as I'm aware, though you'll probably have to ask Grommit to double-check, only the highest positive or negative granted by armor applies.

What does this mean? If you're holding a shield and wearing two pieces of armor that give +deflect, you'll only get the bonuses from the shield and the piece of armor that gives the HIGHEST bonus.

As far as the discussion goes, I have no useful opinion to add, I just thought I'd shed light onto the situation.
Almost. Actually it ignores the armor's list of skill buffs/debuffs completely. So the + and - deflect boosts on your armor are meaningless, likely made so for the reason Krelm said, but no one got around to removing them from the gear. However the code ignores them in actual combat, it just happens to still show them on eval. Only your shield's deflect boost is counted.

What you're thinking of for applying a single boost might be the electronic enhancers stuff from ARPI, but we don't have electronics in LRPI/SOI.
Haha, all that back and forth only to find this out :p.

Krelm mentioned that you could simply wear a shield for its boost in old SoI and that doesn't seem right. Is that still the case here, or if its worn does it go in the same category as the armor and is ignored, and is only applied if its held?
Since we're all telling things Kithrater said: I wondered if you could do that and he said you couldn't. And just like Krelm said: you'll actually have to ask Grommit.

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Grommit
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Grommit » Sat Feb 21, 2015 11:55 pm

tehkory wrote:
Brian wrote:
Haha, all that back and forth only to find this out :p.

Krelm mentioned that you could simply wear a shield for its boost in old SoI and that doesn't seem right. Is that still the case here, or if its worn does it go in the same category as the armor and is ignored, and is only applied if its held?
Since we're all telling things Kithrater said: I wondered if you could do that and he said you couldn't. And just like Krelm said: you'll actually have to ask Grommit.
I'm not supposed to give out secrets, but I fail to see how "Hey does this totally unrealistic immersion breaking twink move actually work?" is a secret. My philosophy is combat should make sense and not require inside knowledge of its little quirks, but rather just common sense. If there are quirks that are contrary to common sense, then combat in that respect is probably broken and needs fixing or, (less likely) common sense is misinformed.

When old SOI simply added up all boosts from all gear worn somewhere, then yes, all you have to do is wear it somewhere. We now only apply its boosts if it's in one of your hands.

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krelm
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by krelm » Sun Feb 22, 2015 12:47 am

I really do miss rocking around with a half dozen shields, though.
One among the fence.

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Icarus
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Icarus » Sun Feb 22, 2015 1:17 am

You mean horses, don't you?
[Petition: Player] I am ready to begin my interdimensional adventure.

A mutilated little orc murmurs, nodding as he mutters,
"I fought good today. Yuh. Fought good, 'specially for bein' the kitchen-snaga. Yuh, I did."

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Melkor
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Melkor » Mon Feb 23, 2015 12:10 pm

Grommit wrote:When old SOI simply added up all boosts from all gear worn somewhere, then yes, all you have to do is wear it somewhere. We now only apply its boosts if it's in one of your hands.
So then, according to what you said here, the bonuses and hindrances to sneak and hide do not work either, correct? Only what you're holding in your hands.
“If you would be a real seeker after truth, it is necessary that at least once in your life you doubt, as far as possible, all things.”

― René Descartes

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Grommit
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Grommit » Mon Feb 23, 2015 2:01 pm

Melkor wrote:
Grommit wrote:When old SOI simply added up all boosts from all gear worn somewhere, then yes, all you have to do is wear it somewhere. We now only apply its boosts if it's in one of your hands.
So then, according to what you said here, the bonuses and hindrances to sneak and hide do not work either, correct? Only what you're holding in your hands.
I just reread my posts on this thread and thought I had made it clear, but it turns out I did not. Sorry about that.

I was referring only to Deflect (or in the old days Block and Parry) boosts during combat.

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radioactivejesus
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by radioactivejesus » Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:02 pm

Brian wrote: Of course, I'm also in the camp who thinks it should be impossible to sneak/hide in metal armor period, so know that I'm coming at it from that angle.
you could strap a dozen wind-chimes to a guy, and if they hiding in a deep forest, someone didn't know to look for them would likely still not come across the person. In such a vast and densely forested region, just wearing a set of armour wouldn't suddenly make you into a beacon for everyone 3 leagues away to notice. I think the large nerfs to sneak do a fine job of representing the noise generated by chainmail. If you try to get close to anyone, they will spot you easily. But sneaking around from a distance or remaining motionless and you'll have a mediocre chance
A really bad sword with a short blade lies here.
look sword
This sword hardly even a sword. It's kind of really just a piece of metal bent like a sword. Its blade is rather short. Kind of pathetic, really.

Inzannadee
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Inzannadee » Thu Feb 26, 2015 7:13 am

Grommit wrote:Actually it ignores the armor's list of skill buffs/debuffs completely.
All skills? The sneaking and hiding hindrances and improvements as well? :shock:

Matt
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Matt » Thu Feb 26, 2015 9:16 am

That's pretty disappointing. Should fix it for all of them.

So the difference between bog iron maille and iron maille is iron is a bit lighter and more durable? That's kind of lame considering it takes something like 200+ ore to make a set of iron with no mistakes. While a suit of bog iron is more like 50.

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Brian
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Brian » Thu Feb 26, 2015 9:27 am

Grommit wrote:
Melkor wrote:
Grommit wrote:When old SOI simply added up all boosts from all gear worn somewhere, then yes, all you have to do is wear it somewhere. We now only apply its boosts if it's in one of your hands.
So then, according to what you said here, the bonuses and hindrances to sneak and hide do not work either, correct? Only what you're holding in your hands.
I just reread my posts on this thread and thought I had made it clear, but it turns out I did not. Sorry about that.

I was referring only to Deflect (or in the old days Block and Parry) boosts during combat.
No, it isn't all skills, it only ignores any buffs related to deflect. Deflect buffs only apply if the item is in your hand. According to the above Grommit quote, other buffs or debuffs on armor, such as to sneak and hide, are active if worn.

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radioactivejesus
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by radioactivejesus » Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:16 pm

yea, that's quite a big downer considering how staff introduced the new armour quality code thats whole draw was giving well made equipment a minor deflect boost
A really bad sword with a short blade lies here.
look sword
This sword hardly even a sword. It's kind of really just a piece of metal bent like a sword. Its blade is rather short. Kind of pathetic, really.

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Justanothacivy
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Re: Encumbrance and Hindrance

Post by Justanothacivy » Sat Feb 28, 2015 1:41 pm

Mind Blown......
Things that made me smile:
Icarus wrote:I'm going to kill the next character I see doing stuff like that. I'm not joking.

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