Unarmed weapons?

[Tykanis]

Alright, so I have always been curious though have no idea where to put this topic so I just put it here. Anyway, We have this skill call brawling right? Buuuuut, It serves no real use to be entirely honest because the moment a fight breaks out someone uses it as an excuse to draw a weapon and get all stabbity stabbity. So, I was thinking...Why not have weapons that use the brawling skill? Things of this sort would be like, metaltype knuckles, clawed war gauntlets, or other things of the sort. I was also thinking however that you don't get any deflect when brawling which is pretty obvious why as you cannot really knock a sword away with your bare hands all too easily either; However you could feasibly parry with any of the above examples it would just be a bit more difficult. Seeing as you will more than likely not dodge more than enemy A can parry it makes being a brawler slightly more feasible and might even change fights a bit. So, Feel free to pick it appart and do what you forum people do.

[Mavinero]

I for one would be keen on seeing some thought put into this. As for the parrying bit, it wouldn't be a traditional weapon to weapon parry, but perhaps a inward move to deflect or arrest the motion of the weapon being swung. That being said, perhaps such would be easier after a bit more skill was put into the brawling skill overall, like the abilities afforded by high skill with other weapons, like a mace, spear, or sword? I think that in itself would make such a branching out be more feasible.

[Tykanis]

Mmmm true true, though I feel that if it was like Ward, Feint, or Bash then it wouldn't be very useful as by the time you do it once you've already been stabbed multiple times lol. However, Perhaps if they allowed you have slightly worse parry or on par parry with a mace but gave you a bonus to dodge?

[Tykanis]

Some examples I can give would be things such as the Ulak, Cestus, weighted gauntlets, clawed Gauntlets, clawed war gauntlets, and a trench knife variation. I can supply specific pictures as well.

[Hawkwind]

I'd rather see more brawling done IG without folk resorting to pulling out a sword. It's massively immersion breaking to see somebody throw a punch (Human side) and have six armed men threaten to gut him.

[cfelch]

I would love to see chairs and frying pans and most anything that is easily picked up and not currently a weapon available for use as a damage modifier (by weight) in brawling/thrown.
Wooden things would potentially get smashed up into scrap.

[Real]

But can these various brawling implements be sheathed and used like regular weapons? We're for sure gonna get some people killing boar sows with ladles.

Cause then you know you gotta keep your ironwood chair and dual pitted frying pans on-hand. If you wanna be a brawling legend you're gonna have to eventually train against hardcore animals.

Using an ironwood chair, @ forces his enemies to keep their distance.

[cfelch]

Who leaves town without camping supplies?

[Patty]

I would love to see chairs and frying pans and most anything that is easily picked up and not currently a weapon available for use as a damage modifier (by weight) in brawling/thrown.
Wooden things would potentially get smashed up into scrap.

I've suffered more injuries IG with frying pans than anything else...no lie.

[Hawkwind]

Who leaves town without camping supplies?

City folk. Even nowaday, "will be electrical outlets way out in the forest?"

"Can yoy drink this dirty, brackish swamp water?"

[Tykanis]

O.o Well most of the things I supplied cannot be sheathed as they are worn on the hands, however things like the trench knife variant could feasibly be sheathed

[LadyMizra]

But can these various brawling implements be sheathed and used like regular weapons? We're for sure gonna get some people killing boar sows with ladles.

Tbh I want to see this....

[Hawkwind]

Perhaps leather wraps that cam be used similar to wooden weapons? Otherwise im not too sure how brawling weapons like claws and nladed gauntlets fit in with Tolkiem's world, other than they do not?

[Brian]

Yeah, they totally don't fit the setting, and secondarily to that, the idea of using a brawling type weapon in actual combat is ridiculous. Imagining a guy with a spiked gauntlet attacking a guy with a spear, sword, or mace on the battlefield is comical.

A brawling type weapon makes sense in the context of improving your success in a brawl, so if you're fighting someone else that's unarmed brass knuckles are going to give you an advantage. However any brawling weapon shouldn't hold a candle to any weapon designed for war, or even a good dagger for that matter.

[tehkory]

Yeah, they totally don't fit the setting, and secondarily to that, the idea of using a brawling type weapon in actual combat is ridiculous. Imagining a guy with a spiked gauntlet attacking a guy with a spear, sword, or mace on the battlefield is comical.

A brawling type weapon makes sense in the context of improving your success in a brawl, so if you're fighting someone else that's unarmed brass knuckles are going to give you an advantage. However any brawling weapon shouldn't hold a candle to any weapon designed for war, or even a good dagger for that matter.

Or even a bad dagger for that matter!

I've seen enough players that get more roleplay points than they should trying to play the badass kung-fu monk that focuses solely on unarmed on MUDs where that might -actually- make sense. It'll be even worse if it happens on SoI.

[Oblivion]

now here's a scenario that will never coded play out in a mud...


Player A with a spear stabs at Player B with clawed/spiked gauntlets.

Player B rolls with the blow, grabbing the spear with one hand while dragging the opposition closer and taking complete advantage of the fact that Player A has a mid to long range weapon that is completely useless at close ranges, and tears Player A's throat out.

Cotd :

Player A slashes/stabs with x-generic sword item at Player B who has clawed gauntlets/spiked knuckle wraps.

Player B manages to evade the initial trio of wild slashes and closes range, to punch Player A in the face rupturing the eyes and rendering player A completely impotent in battle. Player B then goes on to rip apart player A at his leisure.

Or Ctd pt 2:
Player A swings his heavy mace at Player B who has clawed gauntlets, cestus, spiked knuckle wraps...

Player B catches the wrist of Player A in grip, stopping the attack and generally making the mace impotent meanwhile Player B jabs in forward at throat, eyes, sensitive mouth, ears, or reaches up to just tear off Player A's helmet and commence wailing on soft tissue...

Have we noticed a trend? It is a very specific skill set, with very specific ifs/ands/buts that could or couldn't happen with various brawling -centric weapons that can literally not be coded into actual code combat scenarios but still make them brutally efficient. Granted, most of these are 'Gladiator' type scenerioes that likely aren't going to come up in a 'mass warfare' but are still viable in a fantasy setting.

[cfelch]

The more I think about it, brawling weapons of the sort proposed would be counter intuitive to gameplay.

What is the pointed of deadly brawling weapons?
To kill in a brawl.
PvP
Brawls should be about RP moreso then ending life.
Even the criminal element should be hesitant to use them, as it would only draw attention to them.

Really has nothing to do with cannon in my eyes

[Justanothacivy]

Better tell that to anyone using a dagger. They are not really practical weapons of warfare-- oh wait elves.

Couldn't imagine an orc with a clawed gauntlet or a dwarf with a caestus or an elf with a punching dagger? Not even a little?

I like canons they go BOOM.

[Mithrandur]

As is, brawling can already be decently effective given the proper skill/stat combo. That said, don't go expecting even an experienced brawler to be taking on anything but complete novices with weapons, and even then a lucky hit can turn a seemingly sure win nasty quickly.

Still, I don't think brawling weapons really have any place in SoI in its current iteration, nor in Laketown. Brawlers who have the skill already have a heavily decisive edge against those who do not, and it makes -very- little sense for someone to go out and think "Yeah, punching this bear is a -great- idea." regardless of what sort of hand-to-hand weapon they might have. It's already pushing it when people do it with anything less than the heaviest of weapons.

[radioactivejesus]

wouldn't hurt to see a few ad-hoc brawling weapons for ruffians to use. In old SOI there were even brawling weapons that were worn on the hands rather than wielded, and would simply grant a bonus to the brawling skill when equipped. What I don't want to see is brawling weapons that are able to go toe-to-toe with daggers and actual weapons.

[Patty]

I agree with the above post. I'd be nice to have in the orc sphere to make brawling more interesting than just fist fights.