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Starting deflect skill level

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Starting deflect skill level

Postby Letters » Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:21 am

I just exchanged a couple PMs, with general observations on the new skill system. It seems that two characters with similar numbers of skills can have very different starting levels in them. That's okay, I guess, if it's down to stats just mattering again now.

But.

But deflect is far and away the most important combat skill. Even if there's to be variation in it, it needs to start above novice to make a combat PC properly viable (unless you're irkallia). As a test, I'd suggest loading up two identically outfitted, statted and skilled NPCs, with the exception of deflect - set one's skill to 45, the other to 25. Test them against moderately tough mobs. There's a huge difference there, promise.

Perhaps certain skill starting levels warrant a second look? Or at least, even if not now, can it be kept in mind for a few weeks down the line?

Also, there's always the off-chance that dodge does something other than get used for brawls now. That could change things and if so I'll hush again.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Throttle » Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:25 am

On ARPI/PRPI, starting deflect was a static 30 regardless of other skills' starting values for this reason, and we had to stop letting people put their highest skill boost in it because starting with more than 40 was overpowered.

PCs starting with novice deflect here are literally worse than the worst fighter that ever existed on A/PRPI. Those starting with familiar have the equivalent of a 2-3RPP skill boost in deflect. Seems a bit excessive. Two skill levels in deflect make an absolutely staggering, gamechanging difference, much moreso than any other skill. It's also weeks worth of skillgains, being by far the hardest skill to raise.

Deflect is 75% of a character's combat prowess. The rest is the combined factors of their stats, weapon skill, style skill and equipment. It's that order of magnitude.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Icarus » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:17 am

So your recommendation is to set it to 30 for everyone?
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby WorkerDrone » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:19 am

I would recommend this, as a start. There's more balancing than that involved when dealing with wilderness, specifically, but amateur deflect, deadset 30, would probably alleviate it just a little without making starting PCs OP in PVP.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Letters » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:38 am

Icarus wrote:So your recommendation is to set it to 30 for everyone?


I would err towards a minimum 35 for the first two months until the economy's stabilized and PCs are equipped sufficiently that a small fox won't tear apart a newbie. The start of both ARPI and PRPI were kind of hellish due to the lack of gear, though ARPI was much worse than PRPI. At least on Parallel, we had a crop of players (by which I mean me and Kory :P ) who knew the combat code and setting very well indeed, and could by and large keep their crews alive. We're kind of back to square one with regard to setting here, and there is a whole bunch of players who don't know the code at all. Hence 35 till there's some proper gear and moderately skilled PCs about.

Other skills are fine having varying start levels, but deflect? That's just too harsh on anyone who hasn't prioritized dexterity and intelligence in some fashion. If staff still want variance - fair enough, but I'd make it plus or minus three, tops. Throttle's PC, for example, has deflect at least eleven points lower than mine. That's kind of bonkers.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Throttle » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:42 am

Yeah, I think 35 makes sense. It's a bit iffy to reduce the skills of people who have already rolled in, though, so unless some PCs have started with deflect significantly above 40, I wouldn't want to be the admin who has to tell people they had to lose skill points because of some guys on a forum! :D

If you still want stats to affect it then I think a minimum of 35, with the potential for up to 40 if your PC is focused on dex/int, is what would be best for the game. It'll leave room for those stats to be compelling, which is a much-needed change from A/PRPI, while not breaking the game the way it currently seems likely to do. 5 points of deflect is a tidy bonus; 11+ points is way over the top.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Icarus » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:50 am

It's alpha. I could walk in with an Automech, find Bogre's character, and finally kill him once and for all and call it testing ;)

That said, leme look at the code for it.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Letters » Sun Jun 08, 2014 6:34 am

Icarus wrote:find Bogre's character


You make it sound easy.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Matt » Sun Jun 08, 2014 8:19 am

You'd have to wait until he was back at his computer to kill him.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby kestrel » Sun Jun 08, 2014 9:03 am

Throttle wrote:Yeah, I think 35 makes sense. It's a bit iffy to reduce the skills of people who have already rolled in, though, so unless some PCs have started with deflect significantly above 40, I wouldn't want to be the admin who has to tell people they had to lose skill points because of some guys on a forum! :D

If you still want stats to affect it then I think a minimum of 35, with the potential for up to 40 if your PC is focused on dex/int, is what would be best for the game. It'll leave room for those stats to be compelling, which is a much-needed change from A/PRPI, while not breaking the game the way it currently seems likely to do. 5 points of deflect is a tidy bonus; 11+ points is way over the top.


Agreed with all this.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Icarus » Sun Jun 08, 2014 1:29 pm

I've had Nimrod make a change. Deflect will now start at 30. Do me a favor and die quickly so your stats can get fixed.

Or file a support ticket.
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Bogre » Thu Jun 12, 2014 1:09 am

they see me hidlin'
they hatin'

:o :D

thank god there aren't 50 caliber autocrossbows
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Re: Starting deflect skill level

Postby Throttle » Thu Jun 12, 2014 1:19 am

Timely as ever, Bogre :D
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